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Old 06-29-2010   #1
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Jeep SRT8 clarification (?)

First, I apologize for not seeing the thread on the Jeep SRT8 running the SCCA / CIR LincolnLand CC autocross. I don’t really hang around much on CICENET.

I received an email from the Jeep SRT8 owner (I’ll call him ‘Mr. SRT8’) commenting upon some of the CCSCC officials responses to his comments. Since the thread is closed and I told him I would respond on CICENET, I have to add this thread. I don’t mean to reopen old wounds, but I suppose that will happen.

Every year this is brought up and the result is always the same. First, someone asks if they can run ____________ (fill in the blank) that is explicitly banned by SCCA rules and common sense. Then they bring up that it or some similar vehicle was run at __________ (again, fill in the blank) and/or they have seen a U-Tube video of one running at an SCCA event in ___________ (more blank filling needed).

Next the people whose CIR or CCSCC responsibilities require enforcing the rules admit that such a car did run at__________ (do I have to remind you to fill in the blank here?), but that was a mistake and the rules are clear. They then have to explain why, giving history and common sense reasons.

Finally the original poster gets mad, the discussion deteriorates, and the thread is closed. In this case, the original poster emailed the CCSCC president (me) and complained about the CCSCC official’s responses.

As CCSCC president, I am proud of the officials that Mr. Jeep SRT8 has complained to me about. They explained well why he cannot run his vehicle, including history of the clubs in central Illinois. Why are so many of them gone and we are not? We are careful and try to make sure our events are safe for entrants, workers and guests. Safety is the name of the game if we want to continue offering our events.

I do not see why we have to face this every year. The SCCA rules do not allow 4-wheel drive trucks, SUVs, tall trucks, Vans or other unstable vehicles to compete. The event at Lincolnland CC is easy. It is an SCCA event, I am the SSS and such vehicles will not be allowed. It does NOT matter that Ford Focuses turn over. Any car, if not driven well can turn over. Driver error and mechanical malfunction are the causes of most roll overs. That is because those vehicles that have a heightened tendency to roll over are not allowed to compete in SCCA events.

Mr. Jeep SRT8 emailed me about CCSCC events, which are not SCCA sanctioned. It was one of these events where CCSCC allowed a Jeep Cherokee to run. CCSCC uses SCCA classes, but not SCCA rules. Our rules are similar to, but not identical to SCCA rules. But this has no influence over the Lincolnland event. CCSCC does not sanction it.

In my opinion, letting the Cherokee run at a CCSCC event was a mistake. We are human. We make mistakes. We don’t want people to go away angry. But we have so much to lose if we have a bad accident. We minimize that possibility by technical inspection (which you must pass to run) and by not letting unstable cars run. As I said during last year’s thread, if I am SS, I will listen to the entrant, carefully consider his request, have an open mind, and then not let him run. We can not take the chance. We have one major site and if there is a major accident with injury, or a lawsuit, CCSCC will be a fond memory, but not a club. Not to mention the horrible feeling of knowing you could have kept people from getting injured or killed.

I have referred Mr. Jeep SRT8’s request to be allowed to run CCSCC events to the autocross committee. I hope they will clarify the rules we use on what is allowed to compete. There is no SCCA assignment to a class of Jeep SRT8s and the SEB has ruled on an SRT8 classification request as “not recommended”. For Lincolnland, the answer is no. Since we use SCCA classes, I think that answers whether CCSCC should allow it to run also.

Mr. JeepSRT8 (whom I do not know individually), if he wants to compete in his Jeep SRT8 should consider entering off-road events or drag racing (I don’t know that drag racing sanctioning bodies will allow it) that are more appropriate for his vehicle. I certainly will not enter my Corvette in an off-road event……

Finally, I have to share a comment from Mr. SRT8. I do find it offensive and disturbing. Please keep in mind that CIR/SCCA offers Springfield their only autocross and all the profits go to the Lincolnland Community College Automotive Program.

“I was looking forward to this event along with many others from the Springfield area. *I was even going to sponsor a trophy and prize for us also. *I asked a simple question on cicnet.net about my jeep srt8 and was less than happy about the response from a member of your crew. *Due to this response, I believe many of us now are no longer going to compete in this event. *I raced last year and I have another vehicle to compete with. …”

Barry Rowe
CCSCC President, Safety Steward, Safety Steward Instructor
SCCA Safety Steward, Safety Steward Instructor
SCCA/CIR Assistant Regional Executive
Barry Rowe
CCSCC Past President
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Old 06-29-2010   #2
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i think the prior post got out of hand because it was filled with OPINIONS and not answers. i guess that happens when it's not a clear yes/no answer... at this point, even it was allowed i doubt i would ever bring my TBSS to a CCSCC event just due to the hard feelings that it may or may not create. that's not to say i won't still come with my other vehicles and enjoy the day of racing.

you guys (CCSCC) are a good group of guys and i always enjoyed the autoX events put on in the past. i'm sure mr pockets can agree that we (me and him anyway) were more doing a public debate versus a heated argument and that we can leave it in the forums.
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Old 06-29-2010   #3
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thank you for thee response barry I will pre-close this as we now have the official ruing for these events. Please direct all ccscc questions for running and this topic to ccscc or the autocross committee. Thank you for taking the time to respond.
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